I’ve been reading through accounts of various battles, to help promote the correct sort of thought-process for writing the final battle scene. My initial idea I had rejected as a bit too simple and requiring a certain amount of stupidity, but I think it will have to be restored. The vast majority of battles from that sort of era were either won by some decent troops sticking to a simple plan or sheer bloody stupidity.
If Harold lost Hastings principally because his troops couldn’t grasp the concept of “stay there and for god’s sake don’t bloody chase the men on horses” then it’s not too much of a stretch to have a bunch of religious fanatics just charge straight into the enemy, however dumb it might actually be!
What I do want to find is something that tells me about modern military tactics, not for research purposes but purely out of interest. Anyone got a suggestion?
I don’t have a book on general tactics to recommend, but military history is something of a hobby. Trawling Wikipedia and reading up on battles will generally reveal important things – it’ll give information on use of terrain, deception, manoeuver, and general battlefield tactics.
The US army has most of its manuals for warfare in the public domain: http://www.army.mil/usapa/doctrine/Active_FM.html, I think FM 3-0 would probably be the best one. It’s not very readable though. Sun Tzu’s “Art of War” is always a favourite, although it can be a little abstract and certainly isn’t modern.
Undisciplined troops (including semi-professionals like most medieval knights) were prone to just pile into an attack, even against orders, especially if missiles were raining down on them and there was nothing else they could do. In terms of Hastings, the problem was more that they pursued a defeated enemy, and any troops could do that.
What I would say about most fantasy battles is they seem to involve two armies crashing together on an apparently featureless battlefield, and then some stupidly unrealistically powerful siege machines or massive magic spells win the battle and/or there’s a cutscene were the hero(-es) chop up some of the opposition, then it’s all over. There’s barely any sense of battlefield tactics at all: no seizing superior ground, trying to outflank, no feints, no drawing the enemy in with false retreats, no two armies on higher ground staring at each other for half a day, each hoping the other will come and get them.
Yeah, I’m trying to not get too carried away with planning out the battle scene, but I do want to give the reader a good sense of how it’s happening.
I shall check out that US military website, thanks! Modern manuals won’t be much use for the books but should be interesting to have a flick through. Sun Tzu may be abstract but it is brilliant so I’m going to continue with my plan to read it every year. Far better than ever trying to struggle through the spectacularly dull On War…
Something that just occurred to me – could be worth checking out work by the military historian John Keegan. His competence is highly regarded and I believe he’s considered pretty readable, he’s done books on warfare through the ages, and should probably have a good dose of tactics in them or even a book on tactics itself.
I don’t have a book on general tactics to recommend, but military history is something of a hobby. Trawling Wikipedia and reading up on battles will generally reveal important things – it’ll give information on use of terrain, deception, manoeuver, and general battlefield tactics.
The US army has most of its manuals for warfare in the public domain: http://www.army.mil/usapa/doctrine/Active_FM.html, I think FM 3-0 would probably be the best one. It’s not very readable though. Sun Tzu’s “Art of War” is always a favourite, although it can be a little abstract and certainly isn’t modern.
Undisciplined troops (including semi-professionals like most medieval knights) were prone to just pile into an attack, even against orders, especially if missiles were raining down on them and there was nothing else they could do. In terms of Hastings, the problem was more that they pursued a defeated enemy, and any troops could do that.
What I would say about most fantasy battles is they seem to involve two armies crashing together on an apparently featureless battlefield, and then some stupidly unrealistically powerful siege machines or massive magic spells win the battle and/or there’s a cutscene were the hero(-es) chop up some of the opposition, then it’s all over. There’s barely any sense of battlefield tactics at all: no seizing superior ground, trying to outflank, no feints, no drawing the enemy in with false retreats, no two armies on higher ground staring at each other for half a day, each hoping the other will come and get them.
Yeah, I’m trying to not get too carried away with planning out the battle scene, but I do want to give the reader a good sense of how it’s happening.
I shall check out that US military website, thanks! Modern manuals won’t be much use for the books but should be interesting to have a flick through. Sun Tzu may be abstract but it is brilliant so I’m going to continue with my plan to read it every year. Far better than ever trying to struggle through the spectacularly dull On War…
Something that just occurred to me – could be worth checking out work by the military historian John Keegan. His competence is highly regarded and I believe he’s considered pretty readable, he’s done books on warfare through the ages, and should probably have a good dose of tactics in them or even a book on tactics itself.
hmm…
History is also one of my loves so I might be able to lend a hand. I have a source called “The wanderer” which tells the life of a warrior from the middle ages and it shows the joys, values, and difficulies that warriors of this era faced. It is a true piece of work from that era so I think it is really cool! I know it may not be “modern” but it could be useful..? It is written by anonymous but the whole thing can be found in the Norton anthology of english literature.
Re: hmm…
Sounds like Grave theif will be amazing!!! i hate to say it but i doubted that you could trump the awsomeness that was storm caller and twilight herold.
you could always read fiction books on wars , like their was Troy lord of the silver bow by david Gemmel which follows a character similar to Isak which fights through ancient troy. this book has snatches of real battles and shows what tactics was used , plus it is a good read.
all the best on this scene cant wait for book 3!!!!!!!!!!
Re: hmm…
Sounds like Grave thief will be amazing!!! i hate to say it but i doubted that you could trump the awesomeness that was storm caller and twilight herold.
you could always read fiction books on wars , like their was Troy lord of the silver bow by david Gemmel which follows a character similar to Isak which fights through ancient troy. this book has snatches of real battles and shows what tactics was used , plus it is a good read.
all the best on this scene cant wait for book 3!!!!!!!!!!
Re: hmm…
;0) Why thank you! My research at the moment is dealing with the underworld, am reading a great book called The History of Hell and getting pretty weird looks from people on the underground as I do so!
hmm…
History is also one of my loves so I might be able to lend a hand. I have a source called “The wanderer” which tells the life of a warrior from the middle ages and it shows the joys, values, and difficulies that warriors of this era faced. It is a true piece of work from that era so I think it is really cool! I know it may not be “modern” but it could be useful..? It is written by anonymous but the whole thing can be found in the Norton anthology of english literature.
Re: hmm…
Sounds like Grave theif will be amazing!!! i hate to say it but i doubted that you could trump the awsomeness that was storm caller and twilight herold.
you could always read fiction books on wars , like their was Troy lord of the silver bow by david Gemmel which follows a character similar to Isak which fights through ancient troy. this book has snatches of real battles and shows what tactics was used , plus it is a good read.
all the best on this scene cant wait for book 3!!!!!!!!!!
Re: hmm…
Sounds like Grave thief will be amazing!!! i hate to say it but i doubted that you could trump the awesomeness that was storm caller and twilight herold.
you could always read fiction books on wars , like their was Troy lord of the silver bow by david Gemmel which follows a character similar to Isak which fights through ancient troy. this book has snatches of real battles and shows what tactics was used , plus it is a good read.
all the best on this scene cant wait for book 3!!!!!!!!!!
Re: hmm…
;0) Why thank you! My research at the moment is dealing with the underworld, am reading a great book called The History of Hell and getting pretty weird looks from people on the underground as I do so!